A few of my own reasons for practicing Orthodoxy
I'd like to affirm that which Wayne Oh said concerning his current stance on the Orthodox faith. I agree with his words completely, and have myself experienced the same awesome, life changing liturgies.
What I wanted to add was a slight explanation of where I am at and why, related to the Orthodox faith, beyond what Wayne brought out in his blog. Aside from the Theological arguments, the historical arguments, aside from "intellectual" arguments in general, let me say the following.
The practice of Orthodoxy is where the rubber hits the road. The practice is what makes Orthodoxy what it is: it is living out the Christian life. Now, Protestants will immediately say, "Protestants also live out the Christian life." And this is where my comments are pointed to. Why I have chosen to live out the Orthodox Christian life as opposed to the Protestant Christian life. (I must say that in one sense "the Christian life" is identical no matter where it is being lived out, but that does not make all systems equal. Some systems foster the "Christian life" better than others. For example, one might find that "the Christian life" can be lived even by a person attending a 4-square church; granting this possibility we'd want to say that doing so would be very difficult: indeed the Pentacostal structure is not conducive to leading a Christian life in many ways, at least from a Presbyterian perspective.)
Orthodoxy, as opposed to Protestantism, seems to truly understand the needs of us humans, as humans. We are forgetful, lazy, zealous, hopeful, indeed above all, sentient beings-- We are a whole lot of bad, a little good, and a lot of it all roled into one package. I have found that the practice of Orthodoxy, through its various "rites" or norms of worship, fosters faithfulness, even in people like us-- even me. How so?
Let me cover just a few of the distinctions of Orthodoxy as opposed to Protestantism that have greatly fed my desire to be Orthodox.
Prostrations/Kneeling (what is said below about prostration, goes as well for kneeling).
Prostrating oneself in the Orthodox church is not uncommon. You are able to prostrate before an Icon of Christ, for instance, as you walk into the church. Often times, after a particular liturgy, you are able to prostrate before the cross of Christ, an Icon of Christ, or a symbolic "tomb" et cetera. At other times, during the service, you are able to prostrate yourself for supplications, or other prayers. There is something real, and something important about actually getting on your knees while worshiping Christ. I cannot well put this into words, but suffice it to say that I have seen a change in my prayer life, and I have been grateful to be able to prostrate myself before Christ, who is King of kings, and Lord of lords.
Now, one might say, well there's nothing wrong with prostrating yourself as a Protestant, so that's no reason to leave Protestantism. Well, first of all, I don't know of any Protestant churches that regularly allow/admonish their laity to prostrate in church. Second, if there were some that do, fantastic, but Presbyterian churches do not (not the PCA, OPC, nor URC). The difference comes down to, ultimately, Protestants may allow prostrations, but the Orthodox admonish the laity to do so-- the Orthodox Christian is fostered in an environment where prostration is integrated into the very worship of God. It isn't something you do all alone in your "devotion time," but rather it is a regular part of your worship practice. I find this to be very important and very powerful.
Prayers of the Saints.
Another aspect that is integrated into the Orthodox practice is utilizing the prayers of the Saints. Prayers from persons such as St. Basil, St. Lorenz, St. Cyprian, St. Chrysostom, et cetera. These prayers are, in most cases (I haven't read them all), absolutely beautiful, absolutely comprehensive-- covering repentance, thanksgiving, supplications, etc.-- and almost always paraphrases of Scripture. I have found using the Saints' prayers to not only be instructive in my prayer life, but also helpful in memorizing certain ideas from Scripture.
Again, one might say that there is nothing wrong with using Saint prayers in a Protestant setting. My response would be similar as above: yes they may be "allowed" but they are not incorporated into the worship routine; they are not invested in the prayer life of the laity. In Orthodoxy, many prayers of the Saints are used in Liturgy, Matins, Orthos, and Special services; memorizing much if not all of some of these prayers would not be uncommon. And just as it is beneficial to memorize Scripture, so too is it beneficial to memorize these prayers, for many of them are greatly taken from Scripture.
Further, from a Protestant perspective, some of the content of these prayers would have to be omitted due to doctrinal differences, e.g., prayers to the Theotokos. Only in Orthodoxy is the Christian able to engulf himself in the rich heritage that manifests itself in the recorded prayers of the Saints. I have found this to be very powerful, and very important.
Censing (the use of incense).
The Orthodox use incense a lot-- incense is not only used in the services at Church, but it is also used in the home for personal prayer. The incense represents the "Prayers set before [God]" Psalm 141:2. As I mentioned above, we are humans; we are sentient beings. In Orthodoxy even the nostrils are stimulated while worshiping God. In Orthodoxy the Christian is reminded of holiness, and prayer upon smelling that distinct fragrance. In short, the incense serves as a gentle reminder of our place before God, a gentle reminder of why we are here: to worship God.
It is not unimportant to point out that incense is mentioned all throughout the Older Testament as used in the Temple, and is even mentioned in Revelation in describing our worship of God in heaven.
Yet, there is nothing in Protestantism that denies one from using incense, and again, there may even be some Protestant churches that use incense. All very well. But, only in Orthodoxy is incense incorporated into the worship of God. Only in Orthodoxy is incense seen as holy, and sacred...something associated with the worship of God. I do not want to attend a church where incense is merely allowed, I want to be a part of a church that fosters its use, and considers holy its application.
Thus far I have discussed aspects of Orthodox practice that are extremely important to me, yet are aspects that could in one degree or another be used in the Protestant church. I now want to turn my attention to an aspect of Orthodox practice that could not be used in a Protestant church. This aspect, further, has also been very important, and very powerful. This practice is the use of Icons.
Icons are representations of Christ, Prophets, Mary, the Apostles, Saints, Martyrs, Ascetics, biblical events, et cetera. Icons make visible/physical those things and persons that were before but mental images taken from words on a page. Icons remind the worshipper of his place among the Church-universal throughout time. Icons, all at once, remind us of those whom have held the faith before us, have lived righteous lives before us, and perhaps have died for their faith. Icons offer a glimpse into the rich heritage and spiritual reality of the Church. When one stands in St. Paul's Church, surrounded by the many Icons, one cannot help but be reminded that, one, the church is a holy place, and two, you are worshiping not alone, but with the heavenly hosts-- you ought to keep your heart and mind reminded of that.
Icons would most likely be rejected in Protestant circles as a form of idolatry. I know the use of Icons in prayer and in veneration, and even in worship is not idolatry. I know that the use of Icons has been powerful, and important in my prayer and worship life. As a Protestant I would not be allowed the use of Icons, yet another reason as to why I am now pursuing the Orthodox practice of faith.
I want the reader to understand two things. 1. These are reasons personal to me; I understand their subjective nature. 2. I have strong convictions regarding Theology, Soteriology, History, Interpretation, et cetera, that have also been strong influences on my decision to practice Orthodoxy, but these convictions are hardly half the story.
May God have mercy on me, a sinner.
Posted by at May 11, 2002 12:31 AMWell said, Jeremy. I think all of this may be summed up in saying that the Orthodox worship God with both their minds and their bodies. There is no strict dualism that is found in Protestantism, indeed our own modern day Gnosticism.
Posted by: wayne at May 11, 2002 01:33 AMtoo true wayne oh. too true.
Posted by: jeremy at May 11, 2002 02:12 AMIn what sense do you mean "no strict dualism" ? How can any version of Christian faith be non-dualistic in the traditional sense of the term?
Posted by: dave nat at May 13, 2002 01:48 PMMind-body dualism? As that is present within modern thought and implicitly within some forms of Protestantism, I would think it is fairly inimical to Christian faith. Take a look at John Milbank, "The Soul of Reciprocity" in Modern Theology.
That there is an aspect of the human person that survives death and awaits the resurrection of the body is, of course, Christian dogma.
Posted by: garver at May 14, 2002 05:46 AMI was just trying to emphasize the point that Protestants generally freak out when confronted with the more "physical" aspects of Orthodox worship, for example bowing, prostrations, kissing, making the sign of the cross, incense, symbols and images, etc. I think this is especially true for some current Reformed tendencies that emphasize the necessity of seeing things with "the eye of faith" to such an extent that it really does become a strict dualism (BT guys come to mind here).
Posted by: wayne at May 14, 2002 08:04 AMYay BT :-D
Posted by: The Dane at May 14, 2002 08:39 PMp.s. To call it a dualism (or even something close to a dualism) is to misunderstand the BT guys ;-)
Posted by: The Dane at May 14, 2002 08:47 PMIt's with great regret to me to see that you
have been "deluded (Col 2:4)..and taken
captive through philosophy and empty deception,
according to tradition of men."(v.8) Jeremy, I also pondered some of Roman and Eastern ideas of the faith for a time. However, their is great error in them. Being a Philosopher you should know that some truth in ones outlook is no guarantee of a sound worldview. Last I recall you were very Van Tillian in your outlook, is this still the case? If so, is your starting point still the Word of God (the Bible) or the testimony of men? In your subjective discussion of kneeling, icons, incense, and what not, this is the crux of the matter. I trust you will grant this point, unless of course you have been reduced to some sort of Existentialism...?
No scriptural basis or argument was offered in support of your voyage into Eastern "Orthodoxy"
on this page, notwithstanding the "strong convictions" that you mention in passing. It's been a while since we last spoke, so I won't wax long into the theological, nor offend you in so doing, but I must confess that your arguments are extremely subjective as you point out, and weak. Don't take this the wrong way, but I enjoy pictures in my study, smelly sprays in my bathroom, and an ottomon to put my feet up, but do I have a basis to oblige the church to incorporate these elements? You say well.. there is a church that has existed for centuries that employ them & encourage others to do so.. & they happen to suit my fancy. I think a better argument, (preferably a biblical one) is warranted to leave the christian faith (the Protestant one that is).
p.s. Anglicans & the REC both use kneeling benches & you may even be able to find one where
you can fight for insence, but I fear that this is not the issue at all, notwithstaning your making it so. The issue is always one of authority. If you would like to talk sometime I would be glad to.
with best regards,
Ray Fisher
714-429-0062
To be fair, I havn't read any of your archives,
I just noticed that you explore some of the theological issues. My comments are only in response to the current discussion of Icons, Kneeling, etc... When I have read some of archives I will likely comment as well, as I have opportunity & you will indulge me. This is my 1st time at your site.
Ray,
First off, it is great to hear from you! It's been quite some time... and yes, you could say a lot has changed.
I have looked into the biblical/theological/historical issues related to Orthodoxy, and I must say that I have not found anything to make me believe I'm falling prey to "deceptive" traditions.
I'd be happy to defend Orthodoxy on theological grounds. I will do my best to give you a call in the near future; we can talk it over.
Glad to have you visit my site! thanks for posting!
Posted by: jeremy at May 15, 2002 12:52 AM